Bravo's Summer House Scandal....Should You Act on Feelings for a Friend?

Andrea Knoche (: 00:00

Hey guys, welcome back to From Mrs. To Ms. I'm your host Andrea. And today we are diving into something that I think almost every adult has experienced at probably some point in their lives, but nobody really wants to talk about it, honestly. So of course I'm gonna, right? So what happens when a friendship starts turning into something more? And I'm not just referring to maybe your friend with somebody else, but maybe, you know, an attraction to a friend's friend.

to a boyfriend's friend, a girlfriend's friend, lots of different variables here. So we're going to dive into that. Now, before we get started, I'm just going to address the elephant in the room. If you are watching this on video on YouTube, which I hope you are, because it's always more entertaining when it's on video, you're probably seeing a Christmas tree in the back. And yeah, I'm recording this in May. But let me just tell you that it's not that I'm being lazy. I really enjoy

the soft dim lighting of the Christmas tree when all the lights are out watching a movie and I just put that on the corner. It's very soothing for me. So that's all I'm gonna say about it. Take it as you will, judge me if you want to, but that's all I'm gonna say. All right, let's get back to what we're talking about. So we're not just talking about some random crush here, right? I'm talking about real feelings. I'm talking about the kind that sneak up on you slowly and they make you kind of start to look at someone a little bit differently.

the kind where suddenly your safe place, your friendship, well, it starts feeling, I don't know, emotionally dangerous. And honestly, watching all the conversations happening around the whole scandal and Summerhouse with Amanda and Wes has me thinking about this in such a bigger way, which is why I wanted to do this episode today. So if you haven't watched Summerhouse,

think there's about 10 episodes into it, or I'm sorry, 10 seasons into it now. And I've been watching it since the beginning and characters have come and gone and it is a reality show. I should probably add that in there. Well, just to give you the dynamics of what I'm talking about, this season on Summer House, we have Amanda and Kyle, who have been together for 10 years, married for four years. They are going through some trials and tribulations. Their relationship is very tumultuous.

and we are seeing it unfold on camera. On the other side, we have West and Ciara. Now they have been struggling within this situation ship for a couple of years now. Things blew up about two years ago. They've been working back on this friendship. They are not together as girlfriend and boyfriend, but in this last season, they finally got their shit together and they are really good besties. Not relationship, not dating, a lot of flirting.

So they could be dating, but from what they're showing us, it is a friendship. Now out of those two couples, Ciara and Amanda are super close. They are best friends. Ciara has been helping Amanda with her marriage. Amanda has been helping Ciara with West. Well, fast forward, come to find out Amanda and I hope you're still following me here. Amanda and Kyle could not.

get it together, they've decided to go their separate ways from their marriage. And then it comes out that West and Amanda have been hooking up for quite a while now. I don't know exactly the timeframe, but quite a while, even during the time when she is consoling Ciara and helping her on ways to get into a better relationship with West, she's been ⁓ with him on the other side.

So needless to say, this is a huge bomb that has been dropped because all of these relationships have been messed with now. The friendship between Ciara and Amanda, the relationship with Amanda and Wes, we don't totally know what's going on there. Is it just a hookup? I don't know. And of course, the relationship with Amanda and her husband, Kyle, and Kyle and Wes were kind of friends too. So it's just messy. The whole thing is messy. All right, so I wanted to fill you in on that because what I'm talking about today is when you do have kind of a crush on

a friend and it might not be the friend friend. It could be the boyfriend's friend, the girlfriend's friend, or just, you know, something that could totally cause issues here. So when we talk about that, you know, what do you do? Do you act on it? Do you suppress those feelings? ⁓ what if both people like Amanda and Wes are now technically single, but other people could still get hurt. What if the timing feels wrong and kind of friendship ever really go back to normal?

once this has happened, will Ciara and Amanda ever be friends again? Once Amanda realizes that West is just a total playboy and she's going to, because that's who he is, will she be able to rekindle that friendship with Ciara? Will West and ⁓ Kyle still have a friendship? Will Ciara and West still have a friendship? So I'm just questioning these things and I don't want to totally harp on the summer house, especially if you haven't watched it. I just want to give you a backstory.

And kind of this made me think about this topic that has not been talked about very much. So with that being said, we're going to have an honest conversation about this today. Let's get into it. All right. So I think that movies have completely ruined us when it comes to love. We think attraction is supposed to look like the fireworks and the butterflies and the instant chemistry and the dramatic moments, such grandiose moments. Right. But honestly, most real adults feelings grow.

slowly, especially after divorce, especially after heartbreak and especially in middle age. Why? Because we're more guarded. A lot of times it starts out with emotional safety. Someone makes you laugh. You feel seen. You feel calm around them. You start texting more. You look forward to hearing from them. You start telling them things that you're not telling other people. And then one day you realize, ⁓ shit, this isn't just a friendship anymore.

And that realization can feel exciting but terrifying at the exact same time. Because friendships feel safe, but romantic relationships, well, those, those come with a risk, right? So now add in other people's feelings, you're adding in mutual friends, public perception or complicated dynamics, like we've been seeing people discussing around Amanda and Wes from Summer House. And suddenly emotions become layered.

Because technically, single does not always emotionally equal uncomplicated. And I think that's the part that people tend to struggle with.

So the question is, are you responsible for other people's feelings when this happens? Or should you just be worrying about your own? You want to be in love. You want to find your person. And what if you feel that person is your person, but you're terrified of what it's going to do to a friendship or relationship with someone else? So this is where it gets really messy, because I think women especially are conditioned to manage everyone else's emotions before our own, right? As mothers, as grandparents, we

tend to take care of others first and then we worry about ourselves. We are always asking ourselves, what will people think? Will this hurt someone? Will this make things awkward? What if I ruin this friendship group? What if I'm just being selfish? And honestly, there's validity there, right? Actions do impact people. But here's the bigger question. At what point are you allowed to choose your own happiness?

That's a really big question. I'm say it again. At what point are you allowed to choose your own happiness? Because if two adults are single and they're genuinely developing feelings and they are suppressing that connection, is that actually noble or is it fear? And if your friend actually knew about the suppression of these feelings or what was going on, would she be supportive of it or would he be supportive of it or would they be hurt and against it? They might be hurt for a little bit.

But will they come around? So sometimes we confuse emotional self-sacrifice with morality. Now, that doesn't mean that you just bulldoze over people's feelings carelessly. There's nuance, there's integrity, there's timing, right? But I think that adults really have to stop and ask themselves, am I avoiding this because it's wrong or because it's uncomfortable? These are two totally different things.

There's a difference between chemistry and emotional intimacy. I know I've talked about this before on other episodes. And one thing I think that people tend to overlook is the difference between attraction and emotional intimacy. Attraction is easy. The emotional intimacy is what is uncommon and rare. You can be attracted to a lot of people, right? All the time we're seeing people and we're like, ooh, I'm attracted to that person. But emotional safety,

feeling deeply understood and feeling emotionally relaxed around someone, well, that's a whole different animal. That is different, especially after divorce or toxic relationships. And I think that many women in midlife start prioritizing emotional peace over butterflies because butterflies could actually just be anxiety in a cute outfit. I know we have touched base on this so many times. We even just touched base on it recently when I recapped Age of Attraction with Ozzy.

Because people are getting confused. They think that those butterflies mean chemistry and Fireworks going off right everything is so exciting and people are always looking for those butterflies And when those butterflies start to fade they get worried that their feelings are fading or there's something not there But what that actually is is that anxiety within you? It's your nervous system kicking up and going hello Something might be off here

So you've got to pay attention. They are more warning signs than anything. All right. So sometimes the healthiest connection is the one that feels the easiest. The friend who already knows you, the person who's already seen your bad moods, the one who already understands your humor and your triggers and your personality. And honestly, that can become incredibly attractive over time.

I think that a lot of times, I'm trying to think in the past if I have had a moment where I was like, oh, you know, my friend's boyfriend or my friend's friend or my friend is super cute and I feel like there might be something more. I feel like I have kind of gone back and forth between that because there's that fine line between being the friendship and it turning into something more. And I kind of...

Enjoy being a little flirty with even friends, right? It just feels comfortable. It's easy to do you can try things out on them ⁓ but You know, you have to think about where it crosses that line So that's a very tricky one and it also reminded me of the episode I talked about with dr. Jolie Hamilton about polyamory and how she was very attracted to her friend's husband which they'd been they'd all been friends for years the four of them Jolie and her husband and

This other couple had been friends for years and she found herself more and more finding herself attracted to him. So ⁓ you'll have to go check out the latest episode on that with Dr. Jolie Hamilton to find out what happened. It's a wild and crazy story, you guys. So definitely check that out. All right. What if this hurts other people? What do we do there? Let's talk about the elephant in the room. Again, not my Christmas tree this time, because this is where the internet gets really loud and has a really hard time with this stuff.

People love black and white answers. They want to just know what is going on. real relationships are in that gray area. There's room for discussion and things to happen and where you give a little bit of grace. That's all in that gray area. Maybe someone else had feelings first. Maybe there's history. Maybe there's loyalty dynamics. Maybe there's a

friend group complications and people immediately want to label someone as either the villain or the victim. It is done so quickly that they have to determine what is going on here. But humans are more complicated than that, aren't we? Yes, we are. You cannot always control who you develop your feelings for. We've said that so many times. The heart wants what the heart wants. Can't help who I fall in love with. But you can control how respectfully you handle it.

Right? So maybe we can't control who we fall in love with. We can't always control what our heart wants or who our heart wants. But can we be respectful about it? Absolutely. And that's the difference. Are you sneaking around? Are you lying? Are you manipulating? Are you leading people on? Are you gaslighting people? Or are you moving with honesty and empathy? Because attraction is not a moral. Deception is. Deception is a moral. And I think people confuse those things constantly.

What if you are suppressing your feelings, but it's not really working? Can we be honest about that? mean, suppressing feelings rarely make them just disappear. They're not gone. We're just pushing them down. And after a while, I think they just start to rear their ugly head. And then you have to address it and deal with it then. ⁓

And those feelings usually get stronger and stronger the more you suppress them down. You're trying to convince yourself, no, we are just friends. Meanwhile, you're thinking about them constantly. You're comparing them to everyone else. You notice when they pull away, you feel jealous when they date other people. All of these feelings are stirring up. And then eventually, one of two things happens. Either you're going to finally admit those feelings, or you're going to lose a friendship anyway because the emotional tension between the two of you becomes so impossible to ignore.

I think it's really hard to pretend that you don't have feelings for someone. I think we've seen tons of movies on that where you're trying to just keep it to yourself. You're trying to suppress the feelings. You're trying to act like you're not interested in them because you don't want to hurt someone else's feelings. And quite often that is what becomes way more obvious because they see you watching. They see you looking at that person and other people are way more intuitive than we give them credit.

And that's why I think that honesty matters. I don't think it's important to take on immediate action. I don't think you should be impulsive, but being honest with yourself definitely helps because it doesn't help to be just stuck in denial for years. So I think that you need to be honest with yourself about how you're feeling and decide if this is a situation or a place that you can continue to have this friendship with someone and still have these feelings without having to suppress them, but just

being respectful.

I also want to talk about how timing matters more than the chemistry. We don't often think about this, but it really does. It matters more than compatibility sometimes because you can deeply connect with someone and still realize that it's just not the right time for you to, and maybe someone's healing. ⁓ Maybe someone just got out of a relationship. Maybe careers are chaotic. Maybe emotionally they're unavailable and that's brutal.

I'm just thinking of myself because I always want to share my experiences, my stories and my anecdotes with you guys because I'm here to help and I want you to have experiences ⁓ go in a much more positive direction than maybe I had and I want to share those with you so you can kind of see those ahead of time. ⁓ But I think that quite often relationships are not happening in the right time.

and we tend to stay in them longer than we should because we are hoping that they will change or we can fix something or it will continue to get better or feelings will develop. ⁓ The chaos will simmer and come down. ⁓ But I think that when you're really honest with yourself and the person that you're in the relationship with, if you can recognize that, yes, you can be totally into each other and attracted to each other and so compatible with each other.

but it's just not the right timing. Something is off, something is missing. And I'm actually going through that now, if I'm being honest. ⁓ I've been with somebody for about six or seven months now. I haven't talked about it too much, and maybe this is why. I get a little nervous to put things out into the light until I am absolutely certain. But we've gone through some, a little bit of trials and tribulations, and I care about him deeply to

and have wanted to stick with it, but it's just gotten to a point where that's not really possible right now. And we need to go our separate ways and work on things. And you know what? I truly believe that if it's meant to be, it will be, and it could come around at later time, but maybe now is just not the right time. And so we have to be honest with that. So with that, I'm just talking about how timing

may not always be right, even though you think everything is perfect because you're attracted and you're compatible, it doesn't always mean that it's the right time. So something to remember, love is not always enough. And I know that's hard for some of you romantics out there to hear. I'm a romantic and I do believe that love can be enough, but I know deep down that it's not always enough. You can love someone so deeply and so greatly. And like I said, maybe the timing isn't right.

or the geographic location isn't right, or their family isn't right, the situation, maybe there's a medical condition, there's all kinds of things that doesn't make it right. And just because you truly, deeply love someone doesn't mean that that's enough to sustain the relationship or make it go exactly where you want it to go. sometimes the healthiest thing is acknowledging feelings without forcing a relationship immediately. It's about timing, slow down.

Take your time, you can deeply care about someone and still say, this needs time. And that's just maturity. So what about the friendship risk versus the regret that you might feel later? And this is the question I think people really wrestle with. Is risking the friendship worth it? I think a lot of people say that. Maybe two people that have been friends for years and they all of a sudden start developing feelings and this attraction for each other.

they start to wonder, is risking the friendship actually worth it? Because we may not ever be able to get this friendship back again, should this relationship not work out, right? ⁓ You know, there's no universal answer to that. Because yes, acting on feelings can absolutely change the friendship forever, but sometimes not acting on them can change things too. It becomes awkward.

All of a sudden you're seeing them differently. So now you're acting differently around them and that becomes very apparent. And sometimes one person then moves on and starts dating someone else. And then the other person quietly just lives with regret of never saying anything. And you know, regret is heavy, especially in midlife.

think once you've gone through divorce or loss or heartbreak, which we talk about often, you start realizing that life is a lot shorter than maybe you thought it was. And depending on what time period in your life you are making these big changes, it's a big revelation. I started thinking around, I think I was around 41-ish, around there, 41, 42, that

I wanted the divorce, that this just wasn't the relationship that I saw myself in for the rest of my life. ⁓ And I think when I really thought about it, when I was like, no, maybe I can work on it, I can stay in it, things could get better. Could I tolerate it the way it is? Could I just be in this little bit of a situationship because the feelings weren't quite there for me anymore? And the more I thought about it, I just thought, I can't, I can't.

I need to live my life. Life is so short and you have such a minimal time on this earth. And especially when I was just coming into my 40s, I'm thinking, do I want to stay another 10, 20 years and then I'm 60 years old looking for my partner? Or do I want to save both of us some time, right? Allow him to find the person that he is meant to be with.

or that is a better fit for him, allow me to find that as well and allow us both to grow with new people and in new relationships that are much more beneficial and satisfying. That's a really big thing to think about. ⁓ So I think it's about valuing ⁓ emotional authenticity a little bit more and wanting

to stop those performative relationships. You want them to be real and authentic and you want to stop the surface level connections. You want those to be really deep and real and safety and you want the chemistry and the partnership. And when you accidentally find that in someone who may be started as a friend, it can feel terrifying because now there's actually something to lose. So you're definitely thinking about that. And I also

want to talk about social media and how that tends to romanticize this idea because the best relationships start as friendships. That's what they say anyways, right? mean, sure. Sometimes they do, but not always. Sometimes friendships work because there's no romantic pressure. And a lot of people tend to recognize that when they, you know, they decide to move forward with a friend in a romantic way, they quickly figure out, this isn't for us. We were better off as friends. And.

once romance enters into the relationship, think that expectations start to change. What you once tolerated or put up with and you were totally fine with, you may not now because your feelings have deepened and they're aware of those feelings and your heart's on the line and you're wanting to feel safe with this person. So your expectations definitely rise. ⁓ I'd say jealousy also enters vulnerability and the changes that come with that and the communication changes even between

Friends that are now lovers

I think it's really crazy to think about how you can totally be friends with somebody and you're used to doing things with them, right? You might see them across the room and they look cute and they're, you know, they're little shorts and they're tank top or they're out playing basketball or pickleball or running or whatever it is you you're doing and you have this attraction for them, right? And then all of a sudden when you guys do, if you actually get together and now

you're going to see the person that you have been friends with for years and never really thought of in this way. You're about to see them naked, most likely, if you guys take it all the way, right? That is so wild to me. It's so wild. so even that changes the dynamics of everything because now it's different. You've seen somebody in such a different, more intimate way. And so that changes things as well.

So yeah, I think there's just so many changes that comes along with that and not every friendship is able to survive that shift. So if you are thinking about a friend of yours that you're interested in maybe pursuing, I really think that you need to be asking yourself, do I genuinely want a relationship with this person?

Or do I just love the emotional comfort that they provide me? Because those are two very different things. We can get the same emotional comfort from someone as a friend. We don't need to be a lover or in a relationship. So you need to determine if you truly want to be in this relationship or just have this emotional comfort. And I think this topic comes up a little bit more during midlife dating. ⁓

I think it hits differently for women and even men in their 40s and their 50s because when you're younger, you tend to chase that excitement. And in midlife, we're tired of chasing. We're just not doing it anymore, right ladies? Yes, that is correct. We are not doing it anymore. I have so many episodes on From Mrs. To Ms. about not chasing. We are attracting. We're craving emotional regulation.

We want the consistency because that becomes sexy and the communication is sexy and the kindness is sexy. We have a different list of what we're looking for in midlife and a nervous system that feels calm around someone also becomes sexy. And that's why friendships can become emotionally magnetic later in life because we're no longer just chasing those sparks and those butterflies. We're actually chasing the peace

And honestly, that, my friends, changes the entire dating experience. Okay, so here's my personal thoughts. I think that if two people are single and there's a real emotional connection, I don't think suppressing it forever is healthy. I think it is how you handle it that matters. I think the honesty matters, the empathy matters, and the timing matters. But I also think

we only get so many truly meaningful connections in life. And those connections can be very rare. So I don't believe in blowing up lives recklessly, but I also don't believe adults should spend years emotionally starving themselves because they're afraid of judgment, especially when so many people settle for relationships where they feel unseen. If you find someone who genuinely sees you, well, that's significant. And I think what makes situations like

the conversations happening around Amanda and Wes on Summerhouse so interesting is because viewers project their own experiences onto it. Some people do see betrayal. Some people see chemistry. Some people see emotional confusion and some people see inevitable feelings. So if I was referring back to Summerhouse, I'm gonna give you my true take on this in case you watch the show, because it's pretty good.

really even start at like season eight and get a good feel for it on those three seasons, but it's definitely worth watching. ⁓ My actual take on it is that, you know, Amanda and Kyle have this tumultuous relationship. It is so toxic. The way they look at each other, the way they talk to each other, the way they talk about each other behind their backs. It's a rough, rough relationship and it's been that way for such a long period of time.

⁓ And then I also think that it's really difficult for West and Ciara to have this friendship that they're trying to rebuild because she still has very strong feelings for West and that's very apparent when you can see how she's flirting with them. She kind of comes in for a kiss. They do these extremely long hugs and he's a bit of a playboy. He's not the guy that is going to be settling down anytime soon. And Ciara is a very special soul if you watch her on the show.

She knows what she wants. She does not sleep around. She's not one to just date whoever she's very intentional about her dating, which is what I preach, preach, preach. ⁓ But what I think is that that relationship was already imploding because she's too heavy into it and he is just not the person that's going to give her what she needs out of that. Now

As Amanda's watching that and knowing what he's done to her friend and how he is about that. have zero idea why Amanda's attracted to West. ⁓ Other than the fact that he consoles her, he gives her that emotional safety she's looking for. They have been friends, so those feelings have kind of surfaced. Do I think she should have acted on it? I do not. I do not. I think.

that Ciara and Amanda were too close of friends for her to risk that friendship. So it's not even risking the friendship between Amanda and West. She risked the friendship between her and Ciara. And that's where I think it went really, really wrong. Not to mention he was also a friend of her husband's. Just steer clear of that situation. I just don't think that was the right move. ⁓ Do I think that everybody out there is giving them a really hard time about it? Yes.

Does it happen all the time? Yes, but they are on reality TV. They are putting their laundry out there for all of us to see and talk about. So should they be accepting of the damage that they've caused and take their consequences as they should? Absolutely. They should have been more honest. If there was feelings, have those conversations or just completely not even

I wouldn't even say suppress them, just cut them out entirely and go out in different direction. Anyways, that is my take on it. I know everybody has lived some version of this story. I know everybody's had like a crush on a friend at some point. So I want to hear from you guys. Have you ever developed feelings for a friend? Did you act on it? Did you suppress it? Did it ruin the friendship? Did it turn into love? Do you regret saying something?

Or do you regret staying silent? Message me, comment, share your story. I can't wait to hear from you guys. You can email me at frommrstomspodcast@gmail.com I want to hear your stories. If this has happened to you, I would absolutely love to read some really great stories where the situations happened out on the air. So that would be super fun. You can also find me on Instagram and TikTok at @from.mrs.2.ms DM me. I love hearing from you guys. And make sure to comment on the clips.

And if you're watching this on YouTube, there's another place you can find it. Make sure to like, follow, and subscribe because that just helps me so much to be able to get more and more content out to you guys. So all right, I honestly think this is one of the most human relationship experiences there is. And maybe the real question isn't, should you act on feelings for a friend? Maybe the real question is, can you live authentically once those feelings exist?

Alright you guys, I'll see you next episode. Have a great one. Bye.